Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

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Have you converted to DSM6?

Poll ended at Wed Jul 06, 2016 11:27 pm

Not yet, but planning to
2
1%
Not yet, watching for error reports before doing
48
31%
Converted - no problems
60
38%
Converted - problems experienced and resolved
13
8%
Converted - problems still open
34
22%
 
Total votes: 157

pszilard
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by pszilard » Sat Apr 09, 2016 12:07 am

Well, interesting to read such a diverse set of feedback, with some very happy and others unhappy.

Unfortunately, I had DSM auto update turned on, so v6 arrived without user interaction. I think that this should NOT be automatic!

I don't know how I can roll back to DSM 5.x. If I move all of my data to another Synology, then how can I either install a clean v5 or even a new clean v6 on my main box?

I had a DS412+ and 4x 3TB disks, so I just set that up from scratch however I didn't get option on DSM version, it just installed v6. It has no data on it yet so seems to be fine.

My DSM1815+ is still in la-la land.
  • It can't be shut down (unless you pull the cord or I guess, hold in the power button),
  • it shows 0% CPU and LAN usage,
  • it seems to serve files(!) and Note Server works,
  • the disk lights are flashing and I guess it is still checking parity, but there is no way of knowing
  • some apps hang and cannot be killed (EZ Internet Wizard had been "running" for 12 hrs and can't be killed)
I hadn't heard back from Support after 24 hrs :(

Am I correct that I can't just move a DX513 from one NAS (DS1815+) to another (DS412+) and expect to read it, because the OS is not configured for the expansion unit? OTHERWISE it would be much faster to copy my files internally to the expansion unit, than across the LAN to the DS412+.

Can I increase the transfer speed between 2 Syno NAS boxes if I use multiple LAN connections? What do I need to do to make this work, e.g. LAN aggregation (HOW?).

Thanks.
-paul szilard
I am a novice. Don't take my advice as "gospel", but double check it. I accept no responsibility for my mistakes or errors. All comments I give are in good faith, but not warranted.
DS1815+ with DX513 and DS412+ with DSM5

pszilard
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by pszilard » Tue Apr 12, 2016 7:15 am

My system had stabilised - thank God!

I left the task complete then done a reboot and all came good. Sigh!

I completed restoring files from the expansion box, which then was reformatted with btrfs. I am now 75% through running Hyper Backups of the operational data files using multi versions and data deduplication with compression. Additionally I am mirroring everything via rsync to a Netgear ReadyNAS PRO. All boxes are protected by an APC 1000VA SmartUPS.
-paul szilard
I am a novice. Don't take my advice as "gospel", but double check it. I accept no responsibility for my mistakes or errors. All comments I give are in good faith, but not warranted.
DS1815+ with DX513 and DS412+ with DSM5

JOe JOe JOe
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by JOe JOe JOe » Tue Apr 12, 2016 1:04 pm

Be careful if you use the synology in production, you might regret upgrading and end op with serious isues because certain packages don't work anymore.

harmlessdrudge
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by harmlessdrudge » Wed Apr 13, 2016 12:44 am

I have held off on upgrading the Synology to DSM v6 for now because I have read too many reports of problems.

I decided however to go ahead with the update of FreeNAS -- a version of FreeBSD with OpenZFS -- from 9.3 to 9.10. It worked flawlessly, as have all previous FreeNAS upgrades since I started using it two years ago.

FreeNAS's user interface isn't currently as "pretty" as DSM's, but I think this will change with version 10.The apparent QC problems with DSM 6 make me wonder about shifting fully to FreeNAS in future for network storage. Synology's "appliance" like character led me to prefer it to running a server originally, but buggy updates are worrying (I do not have a spare Synology box) and the extent of the tying of features to hardware sales seems a little bit too reminiscent of IBM-style functional pricing of decades ago. Meanwhile, anyone needing a bulletproof backup NAS with snapshot and many other capabilities could do worse than look at FreeNAS. OpenMediaVault is a very nice, simpler, alternative, but I prefer FreeNAS as ZFS will detect and mitigate bit rot.

pszilard
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by pszilard » Wed Apr 13, 2016 1:24 am

I have a spare pc, so I am going to take a look at freenas. Anything special I should know about?

Meanwhile my DSM6 seems to have settled down, so I'm a bit more relaxed!
-paul szilard
I am a novice. Don't take my advice as "gospel", but double check it. I accept no responsibility for my mistakes or errors. All comments I give are in good faith, but not warranted.
DS1815+ with DX513 and DS412+ with DSM5

frado
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by frado » Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:18 am

I use mysql on the NAS for Kodi. But ever since the 6.0 update it's been one and all problems. Rebooting sometimes help. Might look for a way to downgrade again to 5.2, because 6.0 is utter [Please control your language].

jjomaron
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by jjomaron » Wed Apr 13, 2016 3:18 pm

thanks
really good advice.
I am not hurried to update my DS214play from my really stable DSM 5.2-5644 Update 5, to 6.0-7321 ... so I will wait some weeks until a stable (or more stable) version will be available.

jjb2 wrote:I have to throw in my two cents worth. I have learned after years and years of working with Synology there are three things to always do related to a major DSM upgrade.

#1 - HAVE A BACKUP
#2 - Always wait for the first patch update to come out before applying any major DSM version update. The first patch update they release normally fixes 99% of the issues everyone will be reporting.
#3 - ALWAYS reboot your nas box before applying the update. In can't tell you how many times this one little thing, rebooting first, has made my updates work cleanly the first time.

If you can't wait to update then just be sure you can live with some instability despite it being a released product. I have updated almost 40 machines to DSM6 already and only one of them has had any issue - and that issue seems to have boiled down to a bad implementation of a network card driver on Synology's part. Im am confident the fist patch that comes out for DSM6 will resolve the issue and most of the rest.

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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by harmlessdrudge » Wed Apr 13, 2016 5:55 pm

Nothing special to know about FreeNAS except perhaps this: if planning to use ZFS, which is pretty much the point if you want a truly resilient storage system, you should use ECC memory. I built my FreeNAS box by buying an HP N54L box and replaced the memory with 16Gb ECC RAM, which cost more than the box (but still not a lot). I then added some old drives, which didn't have to all be the same, happily. I also hacked the BIOS to make the machine take an SATA additional (5th) drive (I don't recall which site I got the details on now; there are several; see e.g. http://homeservershow.com/hp-proliant-n ... sited.html).

A useful way to understand FreeNAS's salient features is to compare it with alternatives. See e.g., http://www.mondaiji.com/blog/other/it/1 ... nas-distro; searching on "FreeNAS vs " will suggest some (Rockstor, which wasn't around when I chose FreeNAS is compared here http://www.freenas.org/freenas-vs-rockstor/). Not many are popular enough to have community sites at least as popular as Synology's. OpenMediaVault is probably the easiest to get to grips with and that plus SnapRaid would be on my list if I had to choose something else, say to use old hardware and wasn't able to use ECC memory.

I have read that FreeNAS is complex -- too much so for some people. I haven't found that, partly I suspect because once I set it up as an rsync backup target for my Synology box I left it alone and have done nothing with besides software updates. I haven't installed plugins or used it for anything else. Version 10 will be such a big upgrade that I think that may be worth considering at point.

Plenty of information at http://www.freenas.org.

wellnice
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by wellnice » Sat Apr 16, 2016 12:14 pm

Hi,
have a 3612xs which worked fine for 16 month. Had 2 times problems with adding disks, solved by eastasian support.
no other issues in the 16 month.
using the NAS mainly for ISCSI to 1 Hyper-v and one ESXi Host. Both 4 core, so moderat load.
with dsm 6 the NAS was frozen 3 times in 10 days. frozen means: blinking net light, no disk activity, no access. pressed the power button +10 secs for soft shutdown the first time, after 8 hours the NAS was still on, had to press button longer to switch it off. next 2 times i just switched it off.
european support got ticket, told me something about bad memory. nice.
Now i see the new Update to dsm 6, enhancing stability of iscsi on esxi under heavy load, which seems to fit as the NAS crashed always in the early morning when the vms doing their backups.
with the third crash 3 of 11 productive vms were harmed internally (windows errors).
additionally i am a little bit fed up actually with synology at this time as the update-1 to 6.0 is advertised via email but is not detected via update function inside NAS.
the alleged memory errors in kern.log seem to be connected to videostation. deinstalled videostation.
see loads of errors in kern.log in regards to iscsi:
Apr 16 13:00:27 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.172067] ABORT_TASK: Sending TMR_TASK_DOES_NOT_EXIST for ref_tag: 7733521
Apr 16 13:00:27 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.172077] Unable to locate ITT: 0x00760113 on CID: 0
Apr 16 13:00:27 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.172077] Unable to locate RefTaskTag: 0x00760113 on CID: 0.
Apr 16 13:00:27 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.224515] ABORT_TASK: Sending TMR_TASK_DOES_NOT_EXIST for ref_tag: 7733554
Apr 16 13:00:27 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.248211] ABORT_TASK: Sending TMR_TASK_DOES_NOT_EXIST for ref_tag: 7733574
Apr 16 13:00:27 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.678911] Detected MISCOMPARE for addr: ffff8801e04b1000 buf: ffff8801e2ba1e00
Apr 16 13:00:27 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.686313] Target/epio: Send MISCOMPARE check condition and sense
Apr 16 13:00:27 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.692506] Detected MISCOMPARE for addr: ffff8801695ef000 buf: ffff8801e55a4e00
Apr 16 13:00:27 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.699970] Target/epio: Send MISCOMPARE check condition and sense
Apr 16 13:00:27 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.706167] Detected MISCOMPARE for addr: ffff8801e3180000 buf: ffff8801e05b0a00
Apr 16 13:00:27 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.713552] Target/epio: Send MISCOMPARE check condition and sense
Apr 16 13:00:28 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.750464] Detected MISCOMPARE for addr: ffff8801ddc6b000 buf: ffff8801e05b0a00
Apr 16 13:00:28 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.757859] Target/epio: Send MISCOMPARE check condition and sense
Apr 16 13:00:28 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.764185] Detected MISCOMPARE for addr: ffff88015f926000 buf: ffff8801e55a4e00
Apr 16 13:00:28 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.771580] Target/epio: Send MISCOMPARE check condition and sense
Apr 16 13:00:28 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.799655] Detected MISCOMPARE for addr: ffff8801e2fe5000 buf: ffff8801e05b0a00
Apr 16 13:00:28 DL2DS2 kernel: [42732.807061] Target/epio: Send MISCOMPARE check condition and sense

every time i switch on a vm.
so, i need a clear statement how and when i will get update-1.
in the actual state the NAS is as reliable as the raid-5 in a homegrown PC that i had before wasting mujo money purchasing the synology.
DSM 6 iscsi is not forgotten
DS3612xs 9 bays populated, 5 WD RED 4 TB
DS413j 3 bays populated, 3 old seagates

ryan.haver
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by ryan.haver » Tue Apr 19, 2016 8:45 pm

I've been seeing very poor DIsk I/O on my newly created BTRFS volume. Copying to the same volume, but a different share, via File Station is very slow as well as move operations within the same volume. Move operations are so slow that they may as well be copy operations.

I have not yet tested if command line moves and copies are affected in the same manner.

Update: Command line move is fine. This does not appear to be an issue with BTRFS, but the File Station package itself.

noliganda
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by noliganda » Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:26 am

Got a 1512+ Raid6: 5x3TB Segate HD

I'm using a Macbook Pro late 2013 to run the server freshly formatted, upgraded the NAS to DSM6 and I recently installed a Thunderbolt hub from OWC (long awaited) which remove prety much all the cables i had everywhere on my desk, great stuff, until I had to grab my computer quickly and pulled thunderbolt cable un-mounting the NAS first... totally crashed my system.... (blue flashing power button etc..)
After giving it more time i finally have been able to connect to DSM again (very very very slow now) and I realised that on of the disk wont perform SMART status check... i guess i'm gonna have to replace it asap.

2 day My machine has been pursuing a the parity consistency I'm only at @ 1.30% ... at this rate it's gonna take me month to finish this!

Tryed to kill the indexation system using the command lines in my terminal advised in this post hoping to speedup the process without luck:
https://forum.synology.com/enu/viewtopi ... xd#p255134

anyone has better procedure handy? or tricks to speed up this Parity constancy check? (really not liking this process tho!!)

I have disabled iTune server, Audio & Video DSM and I'm gonna continue to disable all system running in the background but DSM6 doing the parity consistency check is unacceptably slow!!!!
I lodged 2 tickets to Syno Support (Support Ticket: #803061 & #802916) with no answer form them in the last 24h..... guess thi is the worse timing as they are probaly dealing will all the new bugs...

Conclusion: make sure you un-mount the system before you pickup your laptop.....

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

NB: is it a bad idea to stop the parity check, take out this drive taht do not perform the S.M.A.R.T status check and rebuilt the array with a fresj drive instead of the one that seam to have issues?

Thanks a Billion for any advice!!

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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by parnassus » Wed Apr 20, 2016 5:34 pm

harmlessdrudge wrote:Nothing special to know about FreeNAS except perhaps this: if planning to use ZFS, which is pretty much the point if you want a truly resilient storage system, you should use ECC memory. I built my FreeNAS box by buying an HP N54L box and replaced the memory with 16Gb ECC RAM, which cost more than the box (but still not a lot). I then added some old drives, which didn't have to all be the same, happily. I also hacked the BIOS to make the machine take an SATA additional (5th) drive (I don't recall which site I got the details on now; there are several; see e.g. http://homeservershow.com/hp-proliant-n ... sited.html).
I did exactly the same. More than one time.
harmlessdrudge wrote:A useful way to understand FreeNAS's salient features is to compare it with alternatives. See e.g., http://www.mondaiji.com/blog/other/it/1 ... nas-distro; searching on "FreeNAS vs " will suggest some (Rockstor, which wasn't around when I chose FreeNAS is compared here http://www.freenas.org/freenas-vs-rockstor/). Not many are popular enough to have community sites at least as popular as Synology's. OpenMediaVault is probably the easiest to get to grips with and that plus SnapRaid would be on my list if I had to choose something else, say to use old hardware and wasn't able to use ECC memory.

I have read that FreeNAS is complex -- too much so for some people. I haven't found that, partly I suspect because once I set it up as an rsync backup target for my Synology box I left it alone and have done nothing with besides software updates. I haven't installed plugins or used it for anything else. Version 10 will be such a big upgrade that I think that may be worth considering at point.

Plenty of information at http://www.freenas.org.
OT Start

Keep in mind that using a zpool created by FreeNAS > 8.3 can be somewhat problematic (quirks) when you want to perform a painless zpool export/import into other Open-ZFS compatible platforms (based on FreeBSD/Linux/Mac OS X or illumos) like NAS4Free or OmniOS due to ZFS Embedded Features (read here and here) that FreeNAS enables automatically...not to speak about NexentaStor CE (read here). I prefer NAS4Free, which is actually FreeBSD 12 based (the whole story FreeNAS/NAS4Free is known) and, as a very minimalistic alternative, OmniOS (it rocks!) or OpenIndiana Text...which are both illumos kernel based distributions...with/without Napp-It (GUI). For a NAS, IMHO, having a gorgeous GUI is really really relative (if a GUI is present it's very important that that GUI is clear and rational)...performance, interoperability, features and overall (read: underlying OS plus Open-ZFS) stability are a real must.

OT End.

harmlessdrudge
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by harmlessdrudge » Wed Apr 27, 2016 3:57 pm

Golly, importing a zpool into another ZFS platform is something I never considered for an instant. I run one box with ZFS and if I were to set up a replacement I'd just rsync the data as I'd be transferring it to different drives. I looked at Nexenta and some alternatives and decided that while they might be more advanced they didn't look convincingly appliance-like for a home user just looking for a home-brew backup to a commodity NAS (i.e., not trying to run a domain controller, nor to scale to support a wikipedia, or indeed anything other than just the ability to survive the failure of a drive). NAS4Free did but it seemed ugly and, at the time, as if it had lost out to FreeNAS (it certainly had inferior documentation and a weaker user community). OpenMediaVault was the most attractive looking of the choices available -- in UI terms and overall simplicity -- but block level resilience mattered more to me (I believe it now supports BTRFS).

Some alternatives appear to some extent to start from the proposition that you know the background and the history already. After a while reading about storage as ideology I fall back on "What is a safe, well-supported mainstream choice?" If Ubuntu had supported ZFS natively at the time I might have gone with that.

However, I agree with a key point implicit in your message: that there are some differences that could prove painful later if you don't know what you're getting into. As I use FreeNAS a backup and don't bother with plugins or any additional features beyond some snapshots and an occasional scrub it works well for me. I've only once needed to retrieve files from it. And the only reason I use it at all is because I have a pokey Internet connection which is not up to backing up my data to the cloud.

I'm still holding off on upgrading my Synology DS413 to DSM 6. The only real value in it for me, and it's small, is that I can skip renewing my SSL certificate. I'm not yet convinced I'll buy Synology again. The UI was a big advance on my previous box, a Netgear ReadyNAS, but open source looks increasingly attractive.

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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by borochris » Sat Apr 30, 2016 8:10 am

I am currently still watching and waiting as this system is too critical to me to risk downtime.
Also wondering if the new file system is going to become the defecto standard as I don't have enough capacity to change

harmlessdrudge
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Re: Is DSM6 trustworthy? I have Serious Problems

Unread post by harmlessdrudge » Sun May 01, 2016 3:01 pm

Are you backed up? I couldn't sleep if I wasn't! I know I won't lose data (well, I have made a reasonable effort in that direction), it's the time I'd spend getting back to where I was that I don't want to spend if DSM 6 causes me any problems. Besides, the current version is working.

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