USB discontinued in 6.2?

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USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by mhammill » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:43 am

What does Synology's statement on USB device drivers:
Starting from DSM 6.2, the USB device drivers, including printers, cloud printers, DAC/speakers, Wi-Fi dongles, DTV dongles, LTE dongles, and Bluetooth dongles will no longer be updated.
mean for using various USB drives in a Synology going forward? I have used various USB and eSATA drives to backup my Synology in the past. Will these no longer be guaranteed to work even if they follow the USB standard? My understanding is that all hardware has some sort of driver (embedded in firmware or as software). Is Synology just saying no to any USB, or some how "unusual" USB device's driver in their statement?

Thanks for helping me understand. It's actually quite critical in knowing what will work for backups.

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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by synology_ukman » Fri Jul 06, 2018 11:04 am

I don't see any storage devices in that list so what's the problem???

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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by Twisted World » Fri Jul 06, 2018 3:50 pm

Just looking at this in a black and white way "will no longer be updated" shouldn't mean any trouble for USB storage devices since these are already supported and have been existing since the 90s. So I guess they will just continue to function.

Looking at is from a commercial standpoint it would be utterly stupid for Synology to disable basic functionality like backing up to USB storage devices. Since they seem to be moving towards small business clients more and more, dropping decent backup functions to a physical device would be a dumb move.
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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by mhammill » Fri Jul 06, 2018 6:49 pm

synology_ukman wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 11:04 am
I don't see any storage devices in that list so what's the problem???
There is no comprehensive list given. Grammatically, the statement they published is the same as:
Starting from DSM 6.2, the USB device drivers will no longer be updated.
The bit about "including blah, blah, blah" are just examples of devices that they won't be writing device drivers for. I'm just looking for a clarification for that statement. That is the "problem." So, are USB external drives no longer going to work with Synology NASes since Synology will no longer be updating USB drivers? I saw someone else in the forum a few days ago quote the same line and just write "#?!/&" (as if they were angry). So I guess I am not alone in wondering.

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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by mhammill » Fri Jul 06, 2018 7:00 pm

@Twisted World
Yes, I too "guess" external USB drives will just keep working. Problem is, It's time for me to buy a new external HD for backups.... How much money to place on my bet? Commercially, it would seem stupid, I agree, to get rid of external USB HD support, but only to some degree. After all, they sell expansion units which--if you read the descriptions Synology posts on them--are supposed to be excellent for backups. So, why not eliminate the competition on the USB side and just support their own eSATA solutions? Several years ago, I remember some forum member saying any eSATA outside of Synology's was NOT supported (i.e., may or may not work, or continue to work). I don't know if that's true, but again, nice way to drive the customer to Synology's own products. Eliminate USB, then make sure only Synology eSATA is supported. I'd rather not take the conspiracy-theory route. I'd prefer Synology just clarifies this. I thought probably someone on this forum had already gotten the word from on high.

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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by Twisted World » Fri Jul 06, 2018 7:17 pm

mhammill wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 7:00 pm
...some forum member saying any eSATA outside of Synology's was NOT supported...
I have been using an "Icy Box" eSATA drive to backup important files from my DS1815+ for quite some time now (this one stays connected to the NAS) and alongside that I rotate 4 different USB 3 drives that are stored at another location for additional backups.

So both eSATA and USB are working fine for me and I am not to worried this will stop soon or even ever. Synology would seriously be shooting themselves in the foot if they would stop supporting this.

Again; I think they just got tired of supporting stuff like USB TV dongles and other things most of their users won't be using. And again; they stated that these kind of gadgets won't be UPDATED, so it should mean that stuff that is working now will work in the future.

I'm not an expert on drivers and sh!t, but I don't think every single USB disk enclosure needs its own special drivers, I think external USB storage is just some general thing that will work now and in the future.

I firmly believe Synology won't be stupid enough to scare all their users away towards QNAP, which is supporting lots of features people want to see in Synology products. I think they just don't want to support future crap like some USB coffee maker made by an unknown Chinese company without a website or even a brand name.

But then again, who is to know for sure? Well, Synology is. And since they don't care to much about participating in these forums, you can only know for sure if you contact them directly through a support ticket.
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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by HarryPotter » Fri Jul 06, 2018 8:00 pm

Twisted World wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 7:17 pm
But then again, who is to know for sure? Well, Synology is. And since they don't care to much about participating in these forums, you can only know for sure if you contact them directly through a support ticket.
:!: Quite my words :!:
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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by mhammill » Fri Jul 06, 2018 11:49 pm

@Twisted World @HarryPotter
Yes, I did ask them in a support ticket. No reply so far. (Maybe they have to check with legal :D ) Anyway, as I said, I figured I would check here since I thought for sure I would not be the first to ask. Perhaps you just think I am dumb for asking. Fine, everyone has a right to their own opinion....

I was going to get an ICYBOX IB-3640SU3 when the question came to me about their support. Glad to hear some ICY has been working for you. The list of compatible USB Storage Devices at https://www.synology.com/en-us/compatib ... evices&p=1 is pretty underwhelming. Another reason to ask in the forum, or so I initially thought.

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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by Twisted World » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:41 pm

Yes, most of the lists maintained by Synology are somewhat "underwhelming". I THINK that devices that are not on the "supported" list in reality are not tested, but MIGHT work nonetheless. I can understand this situation. Synology's main business is their NAS hardware, the packages running on it and some side business like selling licenses and backup space. We cannot seriously expect Synology to "waste" time on, like for instance, buying every single damn WiFi dongle that is available and see if it works with all their devices.

Unfortunately this means you need to resort to forums to check if someone already tried product X on a Synology model Y with DSM version Z. Sometimes just about everything seems to work, even if it is not on any list. I tried dozens of makes and models of harddisks for example, never came across any that didn't work. But sometimes you can't get lucky. Like with the TV dongles. I seriously couldn't buy any of the models on the list anywhere and I tried 3 different models that aren't on the list and these all failed.

So, yeah, it's okay to ask in here and nobody is calling you dumb. I'm just (apparently) not that worried as you that external USB storage will no longer be supported. I think an external USB drive is just a way to general thing to not work in any Synology model. But only time will tell.
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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by HarryPotter » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:26 pm

mhammill wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 11:49 pm
Perhaps you just think I am dumb for asking.
No I dont, not at all.
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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by mhammill » Sat Jul 07, 2018 8:34 pm

@Harry Potter, @Twisted Word
OK, thank you for your replies. I do appreciate it. Still no response from Synology, but I'm emboldened now to buy some sort of external backup. I'll post Synology's reply if/when I get it.

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Re: RESOLVED: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by mhammill » Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:55 pm

Just received this response from Synology. I'm posting it because I figured others might like to know what they say regarding future USB drivers.

2018-07-11 12:30:05 CET
Hello,

Thank you for contacting Synology.

The line you reference specifically only applies to the stated devices and does not reference external drives:

"Starting from DSM 6.2, the USB device drivers, including printers, cloud printers, DAC/speakers, Wi-Fi dongles, DTV dongles, LTE dongles, and Bluetooth dongles will no longer be updated."

This was actually implemented due to the very low demand in proportion to the development, maintenance and QC time devoted to these devices.

I can confirm that USB storage devices have a separate compatibility section which we will continue to update:
https://www.synology.com/en-uk/compatib ... evices&p=1

With regards the eSATA port on your NAS, you are correct that this is only provided for use with our expansion devices (such as the DX517).

Some users have working eSATA external drives connected to this port and in principle this can work correctly but we do not provide any official support for this interaction.

We are always looking to increase the number of devices that our range of NAS units can be compatible with and if there are any products that you would like to see tested, please take the time to suggest a device using the relevant form below:
https://www.synology.com/en-uk/form/suggest_device

My apologies for any inconvenience caused.

Kind Regards,

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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by Twisted World » Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:47 pm

Thanks for posting their reply here. It is just as I expected. Synology doesn't feel like maintaining (testing) stuff that is not used by that many users. Things MIGHT still work, they just don't feel like testing and officially supporting all of it. Honestly, I can't blame them.

As for the eSATA stuff; guess I just got lucky then. My Icy Box is working perfectly, even though neither the manufacturer or the model is recognized.

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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by mhammill » Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:05 pm

@Twisted World
Nice to see your Icy working, and with the chip (JMicron JMS567) that seems to have given some folks (e.g. Asterixx, one of your countrymen, I guess) big problems. Via translation, I read the whole thread at https://www.synology-forum.nl/externe-h ... erkt-niet/ because I'm also in the process of getting an ICY Box, and wondered if I should simply cancel the order before it arrives. I guess I'll wait and see now :D BTW, is the eSATA that shows up in your screenshot also an ICY?

PS: I used the link Synology provided in the reply to me to put in a request for them to support the ICY Box. May not do much good, but what could it hurt?

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Re: USB discontinued in 6.2?

Unread post by Twisted World » Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:09 pm

mhammill wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:05 pm
...is the eSATA that shows up in your screenshot also an ICY?
Yes, it is this ridiculously looking piece of horror. :lol:

Image

Mine only has USB2, which is the main reason for me using it on the eSATA port. It is now on my DS918+, but it was also working flawlessly on my DS1815+ before.

The USB drive is just some unknown ("Orico"?) brand 2.5" USB 3 enclosure I just bought because they look cool (transparent). :lol: But they happened to work pretty well to, so now I have 12 of them. :D Though they use different chipsets, because I have seen at least 3 different names on my Synology when mounting the 12 units that all LOOK the same.

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